Is it possible to build a toon without using Constitution?

[Thorin Oakshield]

This question popped into my head when playing my test Ranged Dwarf in SP last night.

One of the problems I was facing with him is that I'm spending half of my skill points in Forging and Trading, leaving just two points for the other skills.
Looking at the rest of the skills (Ranged, Weap Lore, Dwarf Lore [should have been Weap Tech], Cons, Conc), and the fact that my atribute points are spent in Phys Regen and Dex in turns, I was wondering if it was possible to build a toon without using Constitution.

By doing so you free a slot for another defensive skill, with the Phys Regen boosting your HP.
And an advantage of that is you're able to increase your defensive values, making it possible to start using high level Greed early in the game.

A build without using Constitution would be looking something like this:

Lvl 1: Trade (maxed)
Weapon Lore

Lvl 3: Concentration

Lvl 6: Ranged Combat (about 20 points needed to get maximum attack speed)

Lvl 12: Weapon Technology

Lvl 20: Forge Lore (optional, keep it maxed if you choose it)
If not; Agillity, Parry, Armor

Lvl 30: Choose from Agility, Parry, Armor

Lvl 50: Choose between Agility, Parry, Armor.

Atribute points:

Lvl 1-10: Phys Regen only.
Lvl 11 and beyond: Phys Regen and Dex in turns.

CA's: Attack: To kill everything standing in your way :)

Greed: Makes it possible to forge more Def, Resist, LL and +1 Skill amy's in your gear, without loosing your MF.

Flame Thrower: To kill of those who were foolish enough to try to kill you in close combat

War Cry: To boost your attack and Def values. Last is particular important considering Greed drops your Def value.

Optional: Multi Hit: To take out larger mobs. (Mind you, attack does the same when it gets to the higher levels)

Cannonblast: To take out those far away, making it possible for you not to loose many hitpoints with your ranged weapon.


OK, and now I'd like to know your input of this. :p

Thorin :)

[LazySod]

Technically, it is very possible. Just don't click on the skill the moment it pops up.. :p

Practically, I didn't think it to be viable, until I read your list above. It might work. I've never tried, haven't made a single HC toon so far without the skill, and nearly all of them have it maxed out. Hell, I would use it on my GW toon if only it allowed such a skill.

[FrostElfGuard]

I would say yes. But not for me.

This is for expert game players... not defense in depth players like me.

[Rotluchs]

I once played my first 'high' lvl online-toon without constitution, have a look here:
http://www.sacred-game.com/charview.php?charId=89805&subsiteid=0


( don't laugh, everyone has to start completely from the scratch at the very first beginning ;) )

i'd highly recommend to NOT skip choosing constitution, one of the MOST - if not THE most important skill for higher lvl toons.. imho only, of course...

You may be better off dropping on of the 2 def skills: agility or parry... (mind war cry, what are 2 def skills at the same time for then? )

And ranged weapons as a skill for is out of any major use for a dwarf too imho - except one: beeing able to socket egills/ettols rings without the need to oversocket the minrequirement...
(but if it's the attack speed you need - just invest a few runes into battle rage at the beginning, later you'll reach max speed 220 very easily.. and i also can't think of any ranged weapon that requires ranged weapons minlvl xx to use it in it's most efficient way..)



I see this at what it is: an interesting challenge, purposely not taking one of the most important skills beeing available for all toons:

so go for it, and don't forget to post your results and experiences once you reached platin/charlvl +100 ;)

[gogoblender]

Wicked Topic
Thorin, if you choose this hard road I really hope you keep posting about yer adventures with this toon.
Fascinating
:)

gogo

[Thorin Oakshield]

I've done two attempts with a Dwarf using no Cons and so far things went well.

The first attempt failed, not because the char got killed, but because I had two Dwarves with the same name and accidently deleted the wrong one. :mad:
Considering that one was having a good stock of Rideg-items, the loss is certainly missed.

The second attempt was a bit harder, but things are progressing into the right direction now.

I had a hard time finding some good items; basicly because I didn't have the starting gold to do some decent shopping. Thx to some sponsoring by Jimmy, I managed to get me some good items now.

One thing I've noticed is that a build like this is depending a lot at LL.
I managed to get from lvl 1-10 without it, did lvl 10-15 with only 1%LL, went shopping after that and increased it to a more decent 8% now. And managed to get from lvl 16 to 17 in only 10 minutes. :)

Another thing I've noticed is that I've been making a n00b mistake for 3 years.
I've always ignored WL a bit, thinking it'll increase your dmg, but that you can compensate that by doing as many hits as fast as you can.
Well, that sorta is true; however, doing more dmg per hit is even better at a fast rate.
So I went shopping for +WL gear and amy's and managed to increase my WL from 2 skill points (basic) to 17-18 in total. Which is more or less doubling the dmg I'm doing with my weapon.

Last thing I did was trying to find RSM items as well; whenever possible in combination with the WL items.
Added some + 1 skill amy's and rings to my gear and thus managed to get a lvl 5 Assault CA with a "clean" regen of 14s, but with all the RSM and +1 skill managed to get it down to 3.2s.
Still a bit too high as regen, but things are aproving, as right now the damage factor is 0%, making it a lot more lethal.

The very last thing I did was choosing an aditional kind of dmg, which isn't choosen that often.
I finally managed to get me a 2 slotted musket and socketted two rings into it, both giving me Magical dmg.
Since the major resistances are found in Physical, Fire and Poison, I hope I'm able to avoid the solution of having several weapons in use to bypass these resistances.
Up to now it seem to work well.


I keep you posted.

Thorin :)

[DaveO]

I'm certainly not a Sacred expert, but this idea just seems to almost be screaming to be made a WIDD build. I'll admit this is a VERY dangerous idea since you'll have about as much hit points as a Battle Mage. :eek:

[gogoblender]

I'm psyched for this build Thorin.
Have you left the toon in a house and artificially pushed it's sb up as high as possible this early in the game?
This could really give you an advantage ^^
Also, I have a few hundred million in bronze. If you need more sponsors I'd love to help out.

Cheers and keep writing!
:)

gogo

[Rotluchs]

I'm certainly not a Sacred expert, but this idea just seems to almost be screaming to be made a WIDD build. I'll admit this is a VERY dangerous idea since you'll have about as much hit points as a Battle Mage. :eek:

No. In fact, a char without Const and with WIDD is even more dangerous. for WIDD, you'll have to keep your HP low for the WIDD mod to work fine.


WIDD starts to work when your HP drops under a certain percentage of your total, highest possible HP value..

So you have no constitution and then accidentally lowering your low HP once more is no good idea imho..


WIDD is something for chars with very high HP, consti, physreg/strengh, mounted etc etc...

if WIDD, then with a char that has high HP but low def/res, you can also simulate this by using WIDD/battle rage with a bit life loss and lotsa life leech.

WIDD in combination with loss and leech is also better on magical/spellbased chars like an ice-spammer mage eg... hitting opponents multiple times in the same moment reduces the danger of beeing killed even by a small goblin - could happen when your loss lowers your HP to a minimum before you leech again...

[Thorin Oakshield]

I've done some serious leveling and shopping yesterday, making it possible to finish Bronze and to continue in silver.

I've taken some shots after I left bronze, to show my "progress of idiotry".

Atribute points (http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f139/Thorin001/noconsskillpoints.jpg)

Skill points (http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f139/Thorin001/noconsattpoints.jpg)

From that point I moved on to lvl 30+ and having 4 skill points to allocate sure makes a difference.
Since I'm able to skipp ranged combat now - att.speed is 220 - I'm also able to increase the dmg done a lot more. And at the same time boost my defences too.

As I result I didn't encounter much problems; even when we had 6-7 ppl in the silver server.
Only problem I had was lacking resistances by leveling too fast in the Zhurag-valley.
It was at that point I decided to bring in Canonblast as extra CA.
I'm using that one now to "soften up" the monsters, switch to the Assault CA to weaken them even more or to kill them.
That worked even well against the Shaddar'Rim bosses, although I had to repeat that tactic a few times before they were down.

For Mobs I use the same tactic, with the exception that the Canonblast is replaced by Flamethrower.
And it works nicely too, seeing the xp-bar flash as fast as it can.

The only thing I haven't done is to use greed a lot. First of all because all runes found are exchanged into WarCry right now, second of all because I still think my defence is too low to risk that.

I could compensate that by adding some forging to my armour, however I'm still not sure if adding +x to all resistances is better as adding some amy's with +x to attack / defence.

Something I plan to figure out today.


I'll keep you posted,

Thorin :)